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	<title>Comments on: Is Poverty Just an Excuse?</title>
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	<link>http://ppsequity.org/2009/03/20/is-poverty-just-an-excuse/</link>
	<description>Covering the beat of Portland Public Schools</description>
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		<title>By: PPS_Parent</title>
		<link>http://ppsequity.org/2009/03/20/is-poverty-just-an-excuse/comment-page-2/#comment-29145</link>
		<dc:creator>PPS_Parent</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Apr 2009 21:52:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ppsequity.org/?p=225#comment-29145</guid>
		<description>Has there been a study of the underlying reasons for different rates of disciplinary actions for children of different races and ethnicities in PPS?  I mean an analysis of the causes for referrals and an analysis of whether students receive the same consequences for the same actions?  And does anyone know if there is a district plan for addressing the issue or how the district responded to the issues raised by the JRP report?

As to the Lincoln-Madison comparison, is the issue that Madison does not have enough resources or that it is not making best use of the resources it has? Either way, I don&#039;t see this as an economy of scale issue. Compared to Lincoln&#039;s  attendance area a relatively large proportion of students in the Madison attendance area do not attend Madison. I&#039;m still not clear as to how compelling more of them to attend Madison (as if that were possible) would make Madison a better school.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Has there been a study of the underlying reasons for different rates of disciplinary actions for children of different races and ethnicities in PPS?  I mean an analysis of the causes for referrals and an analysis of whether students receive the same consequences for the same actions?  And does anyone know if there is a district plan for addressing the issue or how the district responded to the issues raised by the JRP report?</p>
<p>As to the Lincoln-Madison comparison, is the issue that Madison does not have enough resources or that it is not making best use of the resources it has? Either way, I don&#8217;t see this as an economy of scale issue. Compared to Lincoln&#8217;s  attendance area a relatively large proportion of students in the Madison attendance area do not attend Madison. I&#8217;m still not clear as to how compelling more of them to attend Madison (as if that were possible) would make Madison a better school.</p>
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		<title>By: Stephanie Hunter</title>
		<link>http://ppsequity.org/2009/03/20/is-poverty-just-an-excuse/comment-page-2/#comment-29137</link>
		<dc:creator>Stephanie Hunter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Apr 2009 20:28:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ppsequity.org/?p=225#comment-29137</guid>
		<description>Thank you Rita. The JRP is awesome. I have always been so impressed with the work they do.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you Rita. The JRP is awesome. I have always been so impressed with the work they do.</p>
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		<title>By: Rita</title>
		<link>http://ppsequity.org/2009/03/20/is-poverty-just-an-excuse/comment-page-2/#comment-29135</link>
		<dc:creator>Rita</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Apr 2009 20:20:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ppsequity.org/?p=225#comment-29135</guid>
		<description>Carrie Adams noted some disturbing statistics on disproportionality in school discipline.  I think this is a huge, but largely ignored issue for minority students, especially African American males.  Brian Baker at Juvenile Rights Project has done some wonderful work on this topic and some of his findings are stunning.  JRP published a formal study last year that brought together national and local research.  (See “Eliminating the Achievement Gap: Reducing Minority Overrepresentation in School Discipline,” Juvenile Rights Project, 2008. http://www.jrplaw.org/Documents/JJAC%20Paper%20Final%20for%20Web%20April%202005.pdf)  

I think it might be helpful to the discussion to cite some of the findings here.  They focus on rates of exclusionary discipline – suspensions and expulsions – since they are the most disruptive of a student’s educational progress.  

Nationwide, minority students are suspended and expelled from school at two to three times the rate of Caucasian students and at rates significantly higher than their percentage of the overall school population.  This disproportionality has increased in the last 15 years, and holds true across rural and urban districts.  

But the most significant finding, to my mind, is that numerous studies conclude that the higher rates of discipline do not reflect higher rates of disruptive behavior by minority students. In fact, studies show that African American students are more likely to receive harsher discipline, such as suspension or expulsion, than Caucasian students referred for the same or even less serious infractions.

“…Studies find that harsh disciplinary procedures, cultural and language barriers, and racial bias result in the disproportionate exclusion of minority students from public school.  In fact, research suggests that African American students tend to receive harsher punishments for less serious offenses than their Caucasian classmates.  In an analysis of the reasons that middle school students in one urban district were referred to the office, one study found that Caucasian students were more often referred to the office for vandalism, smoking, endangerment, drugs and alcohol.  African American students were more often referred for loitering, disrespect, excessive noise, and interference.  This is just one of many studies concluding that there is no evidence that African American students misbehave at a significantly higher rate than other students.”  

Note in particular that the white students’ offenses tend to be factual, while the black students’ infractions are more subjective and therefore much more likely to be influenced by cultural and linguistic differences.

The numbers on PPS are largely consistent with national trends, but have been actually worse.  Looking at the 2002-03 school year, African Americans made up only 16.5 percent of the PPS student population, but accounted for 43.5 percent of all major disciplinary referrals, an overrepresentation of more than 260%.  Stats for suspension and expulsion were even worse, with African American students overrepresented by almost 400% (8.13% of all African American students in PPS compared to only 2.24 % of Caucasian students).  

The JRP study notes in particular that zero tolerance policies have dramatically increased the incidence of the most extreme disciplinary measures, with no apparent improvement in student safety, school climate, or student performance.  I would note that schools that use the most regimented instructional models, including little or no recess and PE, tend to have higher rates of behavior referrals.  I’m guessing that’s not by accident.  And it’s also not by accident that those schools tend to have predominantly minority and poor students.  Add to that PPS’s dismal record on recruiting and retaining minority teaching staff, increasing the likelihood of cultural misunderstanding, and the fact that minority schools tend to have less experienced teachers for whom classroom management is an issue and I think you have a perfect storm for disproportionality. 

The JRP study also notes that minority overrepresentation is a society-wide phenomenon.  “In child welfare, for example, African-American children account for 44 percent of children in foster care, although they represent only 15 percent of all U.S. children.”  In Oregon, African-American and Native American children are 3-6 times overrepresented in foster care, a rate that puts us at the bottom of yet another national list. And there’s more: “In the juvenile justice system, minority youth are disproportionately arrested, adjudicated and incarcerated. Minority youth represent one third of juveniles in the general population, but two thirds of those in secure detention.  Similarly, African-American youth ages 6 to 21 make up 14.8 percent of the general population but 20.2 percent of special education students.  African-American youth are overrepresented in 10 of the 13 special education disability categories.  Compared to Caucasian children, they are 2.9 times as likely to be labeled mentally retarded, 1.9 times as likely to be labeled emotionally disturbed, and 1.3 times as likely to be labeled learning disabled.”

All in all, I think these numbers nicely put to rest the mainstream media’s contention that we live in a “post-racial” society.  My fervent hope is that this administration might actually start paying attention to these things.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Carrie Adams noted some disturbing statistics on disproportionality in school discipline.  I think this is a huge, but largely ignored issue for minority students, especially African American males.  Brian Baker at Juvenile Rights Project has done some wonderful work on this topic and some of his findings are stunning.  JRP published a formal study last year that brought together national and local research.  (See “Eliminating the Achievement Gap: Reducing Minority Overrepresentation in School Discipline,” Juvenile Rights Project, 2008. <a href="http://www.jrplaw.org/Documents/JJAC%20Paper%20Final%20for%20Web%20April%202005.pdf)" rel="nofollow">http://www.jrplaw.org/Document.....02005.pdf)</a>  </p>
<p>I think it might be helpful to the discussion to cite some of the findings here.  They focus on rates of exclusionary discipline – suspensions and expulsions – since they are the most disruptive of a student’s educational progress.  </p>
<p>Nationwide, minority students are suspended and expelled from school at two to three times the rate of Caucasian students and at rates significantly higher than their percentage of the overall school population.  This disproportionality has increased in the last 15 years, and holds true across rural and urban districts.  </p>
<p>But the most significant finding, to my mind, is that numerous studies conclude that the higher rates of discipline do not reflect higher rates of disruptive behavior by minority students. In fact, studies show that African American students are more likely to receive harsher discipline, such as suspension or expulsion, than Caucasian students referred for the same or even less serious infractions.</p>
<p>“…Studies find that harsh disciplinary procedures, cultural and language barriers, and racial bias result in the disproportionate exclusion of minority students from public school.  In fact, research suggests that African American students tend to receive harsher punishments for less serious offenses than their Caucasian classmates.  In an analysis of the reasons that middle school students in one urban district were referred to the office, one study found that Caucasian students were more often referred to the office for vandalism, smoking, endangerment, drugs and alcohol.  African American students were more often referred for loitering, disrespect, excessive noise, and interference.  This is just one of many studies concluding that there is no evidence that African American students misbehave at a significantly higher rate than other students.”  </p>
<p>Note in particular that the white students’ offenses tend to be factual, while the black students’ infractions are more subjective and therefore much more likely to be influenced by cultural and linguistic differences.</p>
<p>The numbers on PPS are largely consistent with national trends, but have been actually worse.  Looking at the 2002-03 school year, African Americans made up only 16.5 percent of the PPS student population, but accounted for 43.5 percent of all major disciplinary referrals, an overrepresentation of more than 260%.  Stats for suspension and expulsion were even worse, with African American students overrepresented by almost 400% (8.13% of all African American students in PPS compared to only 2.24 % of Caucasian students).  </p>
<p>The JRP study notes in particular that zero tolerance policies have dramatically increased the incidence of the most extreme disciplinary measures, with no apparent improvement in student safety, school climate, or student performance.  I would note that schools that use the most regimented instructional models, including little or no recess and PE, tend to have higher rates of behavior referrals.  I’m guessing that’s not by accident.  And it’s also not by accident that those schools tend to have predominantly minority and poor students.  Add to that PPS’s dismal record on recruiting and retaining minority teaching staff, increasing the likelihood of cultural misunderstanding, and the fact that minority schools tend to have less experienced teachers for whom classroom management is an issue and I think you have a perfect storm for disproportionality. </p>
<p>The JRP study also notes that minority overrepresentation is a society-wide phenomenon.  “In child welfare, for example, African-American children account for 44 percent of children in foster care, although they represent only 15 percent of all U.S. children.”  In Oregon, African-American and Native American children are 3-6 times overrepresented in foster care, a rate that puts us at the bottom of yet another national list. And there’s more: “In the juvenile justice system, minority youth are disproportionately arrested, adjudicated and incarcerated. Minority youth represent one third of juveniles in the general population, but two thirds of those in secure detention.  Similarly, African-American youth ages 6 to 21 make up 14.8 percent of the general population but 20.2 percent of special education students.  African-American youth are overrepresented in 10 of the 13 special education disability categories.  Compared to Caucasian children, they are 2.9 times as likely to be labeled mentally retarded, 1.9 times as likely to be labeled emotionally disturbed, and 1.3 times as likely to be labeled learning disabled.”</p>
<p>All in all, I think these numbers nicely put to rest the mainstream media’s contention that we live in a “post-racial” society.  My fervent hope is that this administration might actually start paying attention to these things.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Rawley</title>
		<link>http://ppsequity.org/2009/03/20/is-poverty-just-an-excuse/comment-page-2/#comment-29133</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Rawley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Apr 2009 19:20:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ppsequity.org/?p=225#comment-29133</guid>
		<description>Madison spends more per student than Lincoln but offers vastly less opportunity. What part of &quot;economy of scale&quot; escapes you?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Madison spends more per student than Lincoln but offers vastly less opportunity. What part of &#8220;economy of scale&#8221; escapes you?</p>
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		<title>By: PPS_Parent</title>
		<link>http://ppsequity.org/2009/03/20/is-poverty-just-an-excuse/comment-page-2/#comment-29131</link>
		<dc:creator>PPS_Parent</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Apr 2009 19:18:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ppsequity.org/?p=225#comment-29131</guid>
		<description>Madison spends $6500 per student and Lincoln spends %5300 per student. It isn&#039;t clear to me what economies of scale you are talking about or how having a permissive or restrictive policy on school choice contributes to those economies. 

I suppose you could argue that putting more kids in Madison would make it a better school, or you could argue that more kids would go to Madison if it were a better school 

Madison receives no Title I dollars even though it enrolls a significant number of ELL students and two-thirds of its students are eligible for subsidized lunch. I wonder how you would explain to Madison students why they do not receive Title I funds and the responsibilities for the district and the state to improve Madison that go along with it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Madison spends $6500 per student and Lincoln spends %5300 per student. It isn&#8217;t clear to me what economies of scale you are talking about or how having a permissive or restrictive policy on school choice contributes to those economies. </p>
<p>I suppose you could argue that putting more kids in Madison would make it a better school, or you could argue that more kids would go to Madison if it were a better school </p>
<p>Madison receives no Title I dollars even though it enrolls a significant number of ELL students and two-thirds of its students are eligible for subsidized lunch. I wonder how you would explain to Madison students why they do not receive Title I funds and the responsibilities for the district and the state to improve Madison that go along with it.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Buel</title>
		<link>http://ppsequity.org/2009/03/20/is-poverty-just-an-excuse/comment-page-2/#comment-29125</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Buel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Apr 2009 17:57:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ppsequity.org/?p=225#comment-29125</guid>
		<description>PPS_parent, your reading of the statistics is correct. Though there would be some question about how they were arrived at. This disparity goes throughout the school district in reverse of what you might imagine. I think another telling statistic is the number of high school offerings in say Lincoln and Madison, about double in Lincoln and this statistic also goes throughout the school district in reverse manner. I imagine the answer is in the economies of scale, a situation which is brought on by the transfer process. If kids went to school in their own neighborhoods then the money and the offerings would better balance off. 

A similar issue is raised when it is pointed out schools in lower income neighborhoods get Title 1 money, but this doesn&#039;t break down exactly that way either evidently. And that money helps kids who are struggling so it is not added into the general population of students. 

If you read about 100 different posts on this site you can document a lot of the inequities which exist in many areas.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>PPS_parent, your reading of the statistics is correct. Though there would be some question about how they were arrived at. This disparity goes throughout the school district in reverse of what you might imagine. I think another telling statistic is the number of high school offerings in say Lincoln and Madison, about double in Lincoln and this statistic also goes throughout the school district in reverse manner. I imagine the answer is in the economies of scale, a situation which is brought on by the transfer process. If kids went to school in their own neighborhoods then the money and the offerings would better balance off. </p>
<p>A similar issue is raised when it is pointed out schools in lower income neighborhoods get Title 1 money, but this doesn&#8217;t break down exactly that way either evidently. And that money helps kids who are struggling so it is not added into the general population of students. </p>
<p>If you read about 100 different posts on this site you can document a lot of the inequities which exist in many areas.</p>
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		<title>By: Carrie Adams</title>
		<link>http://ppsequity.org/2009/03/20/is-poverty-just-an-excuse/comment-page-2/#comment-29124</link>
		<dc:creator>Carrie Adams</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Apr 2009 17:51:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ppsequity.org/?p=225#comment-29124</guid>
		<description>Steve Rawley - I certainly didn&#039;t mean to imply that you alone was capable of (or should be) carrying on the work of the crisis team.  You&#039;ve been very clear from the beginning.  

I&#039;ll clarify.  My expectation based on what my friend had told me was that this was a vehicle for addressing the disparity in the quality of education that poor students and students of color receive in Portland.  The discussion is more limited than I expected.  I can accept that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Steve Rawley &#8211; I certainly didn&#8217;t mean to imply that you alone was capable of (or should be) carrying on the work of the crisis team.  You&#8217;ve been very clear from the beginning.  </p>
<p>I&#8217;ll clarify.  My expectation based on what my friend had told me was that this was a vehicle for addressing the disparity in the quality of education that poor students and students of color receive in Portland.  The discussion is more limited than I expected.  I can accept that.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Buel</title>
		<link>http://ppsequity.org/2009/03/20/is-poverty-just-an-excuse/comment-page-2/#comment-29123</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Buel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Apr 2009 17:36:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ppsequity.org/?p=225#comment-29123</guid>
		<description>I think poor kids have been attacked on this website. I spent 14 years teaching the 6th grade in the suburbs behind Intel and 10 years teaching in a far out southeast Portland school where at least two of those years the school had the lowest poverty rate in the state. The kids themselves were innately the same, but the experiences on average they brought to school were incredibly different. These manifested themselves in the school in a myriad of ways. Unless we recognize that children bring different backgrounds and make adjustments then we end up teaching only for those kids who come with the school skills honed already. This is part of the charter school argument. This is part of the drop-out problem. This is part of the misguided testing programs. Etc. So, if it is an attack to point out the need for understanding and to push for equity based on where inequity has been established, then it is. But I have found most of the people on this website to be very non-racist, non-sexist, and non-classist, but also willing to explore the real basis for problems. That is why I spend the time here -- if it was differnt I wouldn&#039;t. 

So when it is pointed out that black students comprise 44% of suspensions and expulsions it is not seen as an attack on black students, after all it is saying they get suspended and expelled more often, but a situation which needs to be explored openly and hopefully honestly. And just maybe someone will take some action which will help fix it. This site isn&#039;t the action -- it is the discussion. Running for office, getting on committees, openly protesting injustice, standing up in your life, and voting are the actions.

Sorry, Steve and PPSexpatriate but it is a mulberry bush worth going around a few times more. And, Steve, thanks for your explanation of what I am saying; it is much appreciated and if there was anyone who could speak for me it would be you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think poor kids have been attacked on this website. I spent 14 years teaching the 6th grade in the suburbs behind Intel and 10 years teaching in a far out southeast Portland school where at least two of those years the school had the lowest poverty rate in the state. The kids themselves were innately the same, but the experiences on average they brought to school were incredibly different. These manifested themselves in the school in a myriad of ways. Unless we recognize that children bring different backgrounds and make adjustments then we end up teaching only for those kids who come with the school skills honed already. This is part of the charter school argument. This is part of the drop-out problem. This is part of the misguided testing programs. Etc. So, if it is an attack to point out the need for understanding and to push for equity based on where inequity has been established, then it is. But I have found most of the people on this website to be very non-racist, non-sexist, and non-classist, but also willing to explore the real basis for problems. That is why I spend the time here &#8212; if it was differnt I wouldn&#8217;t. </p>
<p>So when it is pointed out that black students comprise 44% of suspensions and expulsions it is not seen as an attack on black students, after all it is saying they get suspended and expelled more often, but a situation which needs to be explored openly and hopefully honestly. And just maybe someone will take some action which will help fix it. This site isn&#8217;t the action &#8212; it is the discussion. Running for office, getting on committees, openly protesting injustice, standing up in your life, and voting are the actions.</p>
<p>Sorry, Steve and PPSexpatriate but it is a mulberry bush worth going around a few times more. And, Steve, thanks for your explanation of what I am saying; it is much appreciated and if there was anyone who could speak for me it would be you.</p>
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		<title>By: PPS_Parent</title>
		<link>http://ppsequity.org/2009/03/20/is-poverty-just-an-excuse/comment-page-2/#comment-29122</link>
		<dc:creator>PPS_Parent</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Apr 2009 17:23:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ppsequity.org/?p=225#comment-29122</guid>
		<description>Lincoln spends $5300 per student and Jefferson spends $8300 per student.  Ockley spends $6300 per student and Mt Tabor spends $5200, so I don&#039;t see that schools in lower-income neighborhoods are getting shortchanged - at least not on the face of these statistics.

Zero expulsions at Jeff and 1 percent at Ockley, though the suspension rate was high at both schools - 29% at Jeff and 27% at Ockley.

I don&#039;t envy the task of school administrators in finding the right balance between protecting the rights of students to an orderly and safe school environment and instituting overly strict disciplinary policies. Still, differences of the size I see here are troubling.  I hope the district is giving a high priority to reviewing the whole situation - things like this can get lost whenever there is turmoil around the budget.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lincoln spends $5300 per student and Jefferson spends $8300 per student.  Ockley spends $6300 per student and Mt Tabor spends $5200, so I don&#8217;t see that schools in lower-income neighborhoods are getting shortchanged &#8211; at least not on the face of these statistics.</p>
<p>Zero expulsions at Jeff and 1 percent at Ockley, though the suspension rate was high at both schools &#8211; 29% at Jeff and 27% at Ockley.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t envy the task of school administrators in finding the right balance between protecting the rights of students to an orderly and safe school environment and instituting overly strict disciplinary policies. Still, differences of the size I see here are troubling.  I hope the district is giving a high priority to reviewing the whole situation &#8211; things like this can get lost whenever there is turmoil around the budget.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Rawley</title>
		<link>http://ppsequity.org/2009/03/20/is-poverty-just-an-excuse/comment-page-2/#comment-29120</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Rawley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Apr 2009 16:54:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ppsequity.org/?p=225#comment-29120</guid>
		<description>Carrie, I alone am not capable of carrying on the work of the Education Crisis Team that you were a part of, and would never claim to be worthy of that.

I&#039;ve paid tribute to the work of that group as part of the continuum of struggle for civil rights in our schools. I don&#039;t know how to carry on that work. I place high value on your experience and opinion in that regard. I hope you&#039;ll continue to contribute here.

You and others have taken issue with Buel&#039;s characterization of the problems he describes in poor schools in Portland. I get that. 

I don&#039;t really want to get in the middle of something between you and Buel that may extend beyond comments here, or interpret what he&#039;s written, but I think you may be speaking past one another. 

As I read it, the problem he&#039;s talking about is precisely &lt;em&gt;lowered expectations&lt;/em&gt; for poor and minority kids, something I think we all agree is a serious problem. 

Buel wrote: &quot;When we allow the disruption of schools that I have described, then as an institution we are saying that lower income kids are not capable of behaving well.&quot;

He&#039;s placing the blame squarely on the schools, not the students.

Now, like PPS_expatriate said, we&#039;ve been around the mulberry bush several times. I think most of us here are actually on the same side, even if we quibble on the language.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Carrie, I alone am not capable of carrying on the work of the Education Crisis Team that you were a part of, and would never claim to be worthy of that.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve paid tribute to the work of that group as part of the continuum of struggle for civil rights in our schools. I don&#8217;t know how to carry on that work. I place high value on your experience and opinion in that regard. I hope you&#8217;ll continue to contribute here.</p>
<p>You and others have taken issue with Buel&#8217;s characterization of the problems he describes in poor schools in Portland. I get that. </p>
<p>I don&#8217;t really want to get in the middle of something between you and Buel that may extend beyond comments here, or interpret what he&#8217;s written, but I think you may be speaking past one another. </p>
<p>As I read it, the problem he&#8217;s talking about is precisely <em>lowered expectations</em> for poor and minority kids, something I think we all agree is a serious problem. </p>
<p>Buel wrote: &#8220;When we allow the disruption of schools that I have described, then as an institution we are saying that lower income kids are not capable of behaving well.&#8221;</p>
<p>He&#8217;s placing the blame squarely on the schools, not the students.</p>
<p>Now, like PPS_expatriate said, we&#8217;ve been around the mulberry bush several times. I think most of us here are actually on the same side, even if we quibble on the language.</p>
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